Podcasts

Episode 34- Decoding AQ with Ross Thornley Feat. Blaine Bartlett - Compassionate Capitalism

‍

Intro

Hi, and welcome to Decoding AQ, helping you to learn the tools, mindsets, and actions to thrive in an ever-changing world.

‍

Ross  

Hi, and welcome everyone to the next episode of Decoding AQ, have with me today a real honor to spend some time with Blaine Bartlett. Welcome.

‍

Blaine  

Wow, my pleasure, Ross, I'm thrilled to be here. I've been looking forward to this conversation.

‍

Ross  

Thank you. And as someone who has spent over three decades in this area of coaching, development, training for people and businesses, you've authored lots of books, one of them international bestseller called “Compassionate Capitalism: A Journey to the Soul of Business.” I look forward to diving into that a little bit. But also, as a executive leadership coach, you host your own podcast, and you've spoken in lots of different places, including one I watched earlier today in China, where you had a translator on stage all about goals, so I can't wait to dive into it all, Blaine.

‍

Blaine

Oh, well, let's leap off the board here, so to speak. 

‍

Rosaa

Yes, we where I'd like to start actually is, so the title of the book, Compassionate Capitalism. Tell me what is that? What is compassionate capitalism?

‍

Blaine  

Well, for many people, it's an oxymoron. And that's predicated, and in part on the experience that most people have about capitalism is it's a zero-sum game. And we look just at the evidence writ large in society, economic inequality. And even as racial injustice, gender inequality, I mean, just yeah, all of it stems from economic models that have gone off the rails. So just kind of a little history on John Mackey, and Raj Sisodia. And John was the co founder of Whole Foods, and Raj is a Professor of Business at Babson University. They wrote a book, co-wrote a book called Conscious Capitalism. And Conscious Capitalism basically spawned the Conscious Capitalism Movement. And Raj and John are both good friends.

‍

And I was having conversations with them about actually what I think is the shortcoming of consciousness in the context of capitalism, because yet, being conscious about the ecosphere, in which I operate my business is really crucial, because the more I become aware, the greater cognitive cognition I have, that there are more stakeholders that are directly impacted by my business than just the shareholder group. So that awareness is absolutely crucial. And that's actually foundational to the conscious capitalism movement. My question to both John and Raj had to do with what's the behavioral analog that can tip the, literally tip the activities of business into a more generative position, and that's where compassion comes in. Yeah, acting as if I am connected, behaving as if I'm connected. So compassion doesn't occur unless connection is realized. And so then I start making business decisions, and I start taking actions that are in service of a greater good, and literally the Hippocratic Oath comes to mind for me, as a business leader first do no harm. And if businesses are stepping up to that admonition first do no harm, that is compassionate capitalism.

‍

Ross  

It’s interesting. The use of words and the consciousness, followed by connection, and resulting in compassion of behavior. I know that Dan Sullivan, my coach, he said, if there was one letter in the English language that I had to be on a desert island with it would be C, because there's so many great words with the letter C and great, great ones. And in fact, I don't know if you've ever come across the for those who are watching the video version, they'll see this but I have these My Intent Bands. Have you ever come across these?

‍

Blaine

Yes.

‍

Ross

And for those who don't know, essentially, it's a reminder that on your traditionally your left hand you have your watch, which tells you the time, but on your right hand, it has the message of what to do with that time, the intent and so the reminder. And so you have these words, these one words and things. And mine is co-elevate but my wife's is compassion. So it's really interesting these words and choices that create our mindset, create our behavior. And kind of a follow on to that. I mean, so if capitalism for many years had a particular view and perspective of what it is, and then a conscious capitalism and now a compassionate capitalism as this new model and new economic model of thinking, what needs to happen for that transition? What do we need to let go of, what are the mindsets? And what adaption needs to take place?

‍

Blaine  

A great question. And thank you for that. Yeah, it fundamentally comes down to a mindset shift, I think, what we need to let go of is the consciousness or the mindset that the universe is scarce in resource, and I mean, not just physical resource, but emotional, spiritual, intellectual, maybe I've just named the resource that I'd like to have access to, for my organization or my business. It's abundant. I grew up on a farm, Ross. And one of the greatest lessons I've ever learned was just watching how nature operates. And I mentioned this because nature is really, from my experience, in my observation, the only truly free market economy. And nature works as if everything is abundant. Everything in nature serves as a center of distribution, not as a center of accumulation.

‍

And I think that's a significant mindset shift is if we as business owners, business leaders, business, proprietors operate as if our business and in what we do functions as a center of distribution, then things begin to happen in a very different way. And by center of distribution, I mean, we're looking at not hoarding, because we're afraid we don't have enough, we look at giving away freely, without concern about how it's going to be used, necessarily, just knowing that in the giving something fruitful, will benefit. As a consequence of that. I mean, I take calls from folks all the time, and matter of fact, I took a call yesterday from a fella that's been out of a job he was he was briefed, he has been looking for work for about five months. And yeah, he heard about me, and he called and says, “Do you have time to talk?” And so I was like, “Yeah, yeah, you can book some time with me.” So just a simple talk through, and he's got a job interview coming up this week. And I think he's probably going to get it. But just to be able to give him some solidity in terms of how he approached this interview, because he's talking to the CEO of a fairly large, but almost a $2 billion company, for this senior position. I'm fine on giving that stuff away. Yeah, it's going to serve in a larger way, what needs to happen out there, and I don't know what needs to happen. But by giving it away, something will benefit. And it always comes back, centers of distribution. There's an inflow and outflow, that's a mindset shift.

‍

Ross  

And it's a very difficult mindset shift for many, where this consumption, accumulation, protection, is been a fundamental part of society for so long to protect, to look after to shift that to one of abundance, to one of sharing, one where Marshall Goldsmith talks about knowledge, philanthropy, and in this sense of the givers gain, Joe Parrish book, and it is a shift, and it's one that then becomes freeing, but it can be dangerous when others aren't in that same mindset, and we can get scared. How might we overcome that? If we think we're operating in that in ourself, but in environment, doesn't foster that and might give us a few setbacks might give us a few knocks, a few nudges on the way that might give us a question mark, about that mindset. What would you say to people who might face that challenge?

‍

Blaine  

Very fair question. Because this is almost a utopia as they call it touristic respect, in many ways. And I think the first thing that I start with when I'm actually coaching and working with leaders that I actually work with, is just put it on the table, you will get knocked, you will get bumped. And it's an and what's the consequence of not doing that it's more of the same. And if you have to continuously be on guard by definition, your soul can't express itself. And I don't mean this in a religious sense. I mean this in a creativity sense, innovation…

‍

Ross  

A blockage, restriction.

‍

Blaine  

There's blockage. And an old mentor of mine, a fella by the name of Wilshire, it's Dr. Wilshere. Said, and I've modified this a bit, he said, “People connect through vulnerability, they don't connect through certainty.” And if you want to connect to your stakeholders, whether it's an employee, whether it's a husband, a wife, whether it's a kid, whether it's a customer or a vendor, vulnerability is as far as I can tell, the most effective manner in which you can create that connection, and then you need to nurture it. Now, there requires adaptability, I make real frankly, and that's one of the reasons that I think we're talking here is, that's a change. It is a fundamental change in mindset. And I'll just jump into this one. But the problem with change, isn't what people think it is, it's kind of like, “Oh, God, it's changing is awful.” No, it's not necessarily awful. What's the difficulty is, is that the change with the relationship I have with the status quo is shifting. It's the change with relationship that gets perturbed. And this gets to be real interesting from a psychological perspective, because people value comfort, almost over value.

‍

And I mean, I've seen this time and time again, I know you have as well, the business case can be defined absolutely perfectly about why this change is good. And then it meets incredible resistance in the organization because it requires disrupting existing relationships, relationships with work process, relationships with fill in the blank. And it's the relationship disruption that people have umbrage with. They just kind of go “No!” And it becomes uncomfortable, even though the business case makes sense.

‍

Ross  

And even on an individual level, it's the relationship we have with ourselves, this beautiful dance between our yesterday, our today and tomorrow. And how are we navigating that level of comfort and uncomfort, of certainty of uncertainty, and to be able to be free, be blockage free, be innovative, be creative, be our true best selves, whatever the state, whatever the situation. And I think the reality that we're now facing, this environment and land that we're now living in, is one where the uncertainty, where the volatility, where complexity, this VUCA world is ever present.

‍

And so this connection that we seek with maybe who we were, and who we are today, now trying to free ourselves up to imagine again, who could we be. And for many people, that's scary. For some, it's the most exciting thing in the world to create a new version of myself. So I think it's the challenge to realize that everyone's at different stages. And everyone's status quo is relevant and true to them right now. We all need support and help we all need confidence, we all need compassion, we all need connection. One of the things I've recognized is, how intentional we are about our environment, and the company we keep. And you talk a lot about the effect of coaching and training. And I'd love you to just articulate a little bit of the difference between coaching and training.

‍

Blaine  

Ah, well, I could go on for days on that one, the simple, simple version here, training is usually organized around skill development. Okay, that would probably be the very simplest way of articulating that.  Skill development, whether it's from a management perspective, or a technical perspective, or a leadership perspective, there are skills that are involved in actually being able to execute on domains. So training can kind of come into play with that. You can also train mindset. And it's a longer practice, but you can, you can train people how to begin to organize their mindset. Training and self mastery. There are things to be done with them. And it's programmatic. I mean, there are structures and elements that you can actually position to facilitate that process. Coaching is a subset of training in one way of thinking and the distinction here between the trainer and the coach is the trainer has the information and is imparting knowledge, with the intent of uplifting or upgrading or whatever it is that the client would like to have happen. The coach done well, coaching is question organized. And it's predicated on the fact that people internally have the answers to whatever it is that they're seeking.

‍

So the coach's job isn't to tell you what to do. It's the draw out of you what you think is the best way to do or the best answer to have for where you say you'd like to go in. It's that extrusion process that coaching works with. I had a coach and I've had coaches for years, I continuously have coaching as part of my development. One of the fellows that I worked with Frederick Hudson, founder of the Hudson Institute out of Santa Barbara, Frederick was always talking about leading from behind, leading from behind.

‍

Ross  

Centered leadership.

‍

Blaine  

Yeah, yeah. My position on coaching is that my role is to provide the structure, you as the client, bring the content. And that's probably the easiest way to delineate with training, I will provide both structure and content, and then you as the client get to kind of work with that toolbox.

‍

Ross  

So I guess it's in some ways, elements of having context, coming back to compassion, that there is this personalized nature, that within you, is the version of you that is required for you to show up tomorrow, you might need a little bit of, nurturing little tap here and there. What if tomorrow is so unlike your today, if we referenced this to your ABC goals, A goals being you know how to do them, you know how to achieve it. So it's not really a goal through to see where you've got no clue, no idea how to do it.

‍

In my language, those are the moonshot. my first book was about moonshot innovation. It's so big, we need some kind of breakthrough, that doesn't exist yet to solve it. What if someone is in a situation, in a role, in a career, in a place that requires the transformation that's a sea level? How can they be coached? How can they be developed? What kind of adaptability elements have you seen that have worked, that have worked well when they're facing these level of massive challenges? Is it starting small, what is it name that can really help people that are facing in their world in their context, an outcome that they've got no idea how to get to.

‍

Blaine  

I love that question. It is such a good question. And took two pieces in my way of answering it. First of all, a breakthrough almost by definition requires a breakdown. So that gets into the question of relationship shifting, okay. And the relationship that's shifting is my experience of who I am and what I do, who I am and where I belong. So I need to begin to adopt and adapt the mind of a beginner. In order to move in my language for it is the seagull, I call it a growl. The purpose of any goal is to grow. And if I'm doing this extraordinarily well, I'm growing into a domain that I've never experienced before. I'm reinventing myself in the process.

‍

Ross  

A transformation.

‍

Blaine  

It's a transformation. And the caterpillar being questioned about what's it going to take for you to become the butterfly has absolutely no idea what it's going to take. They just know that that butterfly looks a whole lot different than this caterpillar body that I'm occupying. As a matter of fact, I mean, what are those things that others are calling wings, I don't see any vestige of a wing on my body is a caterpillar. So a breakdown is required for a breakthrough to occur, I need to adapt and adopt the mind of a beginner and that's uncomfortable. So as a coach, one of the things that I do is invite people into the discomfort.

‍

And part of when I talked about, my job is to provide the structure your job is to provide the content, part of that content is what's the desire, where do you actually want to go? I will provide structure that will give you an experience of safety, to the degree that you can let go of old identity and try on new things. Some will work, some won't. But you have to have the experience. And this is where trust comes in. My coaching engagements typically run at least a year, some of them I mean, I got one that's run 34 years so far. And I love this guy, and he's always evolving. But it's that idea of, there's somebody in my corner that's got my back, regardless of how I flail around, as I move into this chrysalis and start dissolving.

‍

And the idea for me is to keep in front of them for the sake of what, why are you doing this? Not because there's an outcome specific. But there's something else, it goes back to this core. And you spoke about imagination. In the imago cell, you mean when you look at me, and I'm now getting biological here. But yeah, the imago cell in the chrysalis. It's a cellular component. And basically what it does is it dissolves the existing tissue, if you open a chrysalis in the middle of the process, it would just be cool, there would be really no former substance to it. The imago is Greek for imagination. There’s imagination being crystallized, catalyzed, manifested, and it ends up expressing itself as a butterfly. But in that dissolution, it's kind of like, “Oh, my God, what have I gotten myself into?” and my role is a coach's exactly what you asked to get yourself into. And for the sake of what we keep that in front of us.

‍

Ross  

It's interesting that their sense of to break down,to be vulnerable, in order to break through requires a very deep level of safety and trust to do that, where leaders or companies in the context of work, so much of that doesn't exist, we're measured against output, outcomes, performance, results, KPIs, OKRs, all of these things. That this space to imagine, this playground for curiosity, to the language that you use it so makes me smile, this ability to try something on, to go and put the clothes on, of a new role, of a new identity, see how it feels. Is there something I like about myself or not? Where everything is under so much pressure? How do we create this great environment where there's enough pressure, so we're not complacent, that we're in this comfort, we need some pressure to change, but not too much. That the negative side of collapse, of anxiety, of mental health issues and stress. Give me an example, because I'm sure you've seen so many organizations deal with this, day in day out of trying to create an environment in which people can evolve, where products evolve, where propositions evolve, what works well for people to do that on a practical sense?

‍

Blaine  

There's a phrase that I love, and it's actually a description of a certain kind of design process. Ontological design, ontological design, and ontological design essentially says I'm a designer, I'm designing an environment that designs me back. So part of what we look at is, as I start this journey, what do I need to pay attention to in my environment deliberately and consciously, that I can design in a way that it facilitates me stepping into that role more effectively on an ongoing basis? And I start small. And it can be, I need to shift this practice. 

‍

Ross  

Your behaviors, little things.

‍

Blaine  

Yeah, little behaviors, little steps. It's designing practices, because practice doesn't make perfect, practice makes habits and 95% of our behavior is governed by things that we have absolutely no aware of itself. It's completely subliminal 5% of what we do is in our conscious awareness, I want to design that 95% intent intentionally.

‍

And that's, again, a shifting of mindset, so to speak. Practice doesn't make perfect it makes habits so ontologically speaking, I want to design an environment in which I am required to do different habits, I'm required to develop different ways of interacting with my world, with myself, with my spouse, with my partners, whoever it may be, that over time aggregated small little things begins to show up in a different way of being because everything is spawned out of beingness not out of doing this.

‍

Ross  

And it comes back to that, the soul of humans and the soul of business. What is its fundamental purpose to accumulate or to distribute? And for me, it comes a few bits are going on in my mind at the moment, as I learned in my adaptability journey of who am I today? Who do I want to be? What predictions am I making? What hypothesis do I have and go and try out and see what impact it has? Is this reality of experimentation? And to experiment, we don't know the answer, we have a hypothesis rather than we know what we want to achieve. Therefore, we're designing it to show what we wanted it to show. And we just look for that data. And we look for those things to prove our point, rather than to truly discover.

‍

And I talk a lot about this reflection of what have you done for the first time today? What have you done for the first time this week? And for me, a company, an organization, a person living in exponential times, were changing so quickly, to get comfortable with that uncomfort requires us to do things for the first time. And that's what you're talking about really, is no matter your position, no matter your age, no matter where you are in life, is to still go and discover, to still go and try things on. How might people shift their mindset when their role, their identity has been the source of the answers? People come to them for an answer to say, “I don't know,” to say “this is the first time,” to do things new, needs a hell of a lot of courage, and a hell a lot of confidence. What are some of the things that people can do? Or what do you do to protect that confidence or to give you the courage? What are some of those habits and practices you have? 

‍

Blaine  

Love it. Two more C words, courage and confidence.

‍

Ross

We're on a roll. We're on a roll.

‍

Blaine  

We're on a roll here. This may seem trite, and I don't mean it to be trite. But a bucket list is absolutely, it truly is magical in some ways, because it sparks the imagination. And one of the things that I love to speak to myself, one of the things that I do, every year I don't set new year's resolutions. What I do though, is I look at myself through the lens of how am I different this year than I was last year?

‍

And that question really does spark some introspection, because if I'm the same way that I was last year, if I'm the same way in my relationship, if I'm the same way in my work, I haven't grown. And as a consequence of that my soul is atrophying I mean it truly does. And if I don't pay attention to that I start losing aliveness. And this is true in an organization as well. I mean, you walk into many organizations, and there's no spirit. There's no vive. And it has to be alive and aliveness comes, when the soul is accessed. When the imagine in the gateway, the gateway to the soul is imagination. As far as I can tell, imagination is the gateway to the soul. So bucket list I mean, when I say I don't do New Year's resolutions, I do do a bucket list. And it doesn't necessarily have a timeframe on it. But what haven't I experienced yet that I would absolutely love to experience? And if the stages of where I'm at in my life right now, it has almost nothing to do with what do I want to have.

‍

Ross  

Yeah, not things but experiences.

‍

Blaine  

Yeah, because getting things is easy to do. Having the experiences, that's something. It’s gonna require you to be different in order to have that experience of difference.

‍

Ross  

And often, to let go of something as well. So that breakthrough. And it reminds me again of Dan and my coach who talks about the difference between dreams and goals. And so a bucket list with dreams. If you put a date to some of those things, it starts to process in your mind as a goal of how might I do that, even if you don't know, your subconscious will work on it, you will collide with the people who might give a part of that puzzle of what's going on. And this is something I've personally very consciously done is to seek out people that help create the version of myself in the future. And so it's through the people and conversations and connections. I'll accumulate the missing pieces to those whether that's skills, whether it's mindset, whether it's knowledge that will open up my imagination, that will expand my ambitions, that will scare me, any of those things result from these conversations with people.

‍

And, again, if we come back to what have I done for the first time? Who have I met for the first time this week? What experience have I done this month that scared me, the more we do that, and it references me back to AQ, and our adaptability being a muscle, the more we nurture this, the more we build it, the more capable we are as human beings to deal with a setback, to deal with unknown, to deal with growth, and to navigate it with grace to navigate it with a smile, not scars, and that those things are so required right now. And that we really focus on this muscle because like you said, atrophy of this failure to grow. It's similar in terms of, failure to adapt, is then collapsing and stagnation. I want to ask a question around sustainability. And within organizations, there's a natural evolution that happens.

‍

And sometimes there needs to be death, there needs to be collapse, in order to have that platform for regeneration. And for regrowth. How can we do that on the terms where the fallout is not lasting, it's not long, and it's minimized. So if we take this conceptual thought that things have to break, they have to collapse. How can we do it that doesn't cause catastrophic damage to our souls or to our being? I'm interested in your thoughts around that this cycle of sustainable change, of sustainable growth, of sustainable adaption?

‍

Blaine  

I'll go back to nature to answer that question. I mean, nature does not work in a straight line, linear progression. It is cyclical. It's cyclical in the in the terms of seasonality, fall, spring, winter and summer. There's a natural progression of birth, maturation, decline, what appears to be death and then it just kind of cycle.

‍

Ross

Energy transfer.

‍

Blaine

Energy transfers, yeah, nothing goes to waste. Yeah, it all gets utilized. The definition that I work with around sustainability, I kind of coupled this with success, how do I create sustainable success in life? Part of my answer is, it's through the developing of the capacity to continuously start over.

‍

Ross  

Say that again, slowly.

‍

Blaine  

Developing the capacity to continuously start over. That is the secret, I think, to being able to have sustainable success in life. A great example, I mean, this actually works really well. I worked with Nokia for about a little bit more than a decade. As an external consultant to them. I ran a major portion of their Global Leadership Development Program worldwide. And when I started working with them, Nokia had and they were a conglomerate at that time. They were selling rubber tires, they were selling TV sets, rubber boots, farm implements, you name it, they were selling it and oh, by the way, they had this little small thing called Telephony that they and Ericsson had kind of developed the GM standard for. I won’t go into the whole historical context on it. But Nokia is about 138 years old, round numbers. It's a Finnish company started out as an agricultural company Timber in Nokia, Finland. I mean, that's literally where it got its name, Nokia, Finland.

‍

They have gone through as a Phoenix, more collapses and rises than just about any company I can think of. And they've developed internally the capacity to continuously start over. And the shedding of, when I started working with them, the shedding and Jorma Ollila was the CEO of the company at the time, he had just been newly installed, really, Michael Hammer and he in the executive team had done some work around strategic focus. And they landed on Telephony. Let's leverage this. We'll bet the farm on it. And what do we need to let go of? Well, we need to let go of all of these subsidiaries that don't have anything to do with Telephony. What do we need to let go of? What do we want to hold on to? Well we got this IP let's hold on to this and begin to develop that. So fast forward in time, Jorma eventually left about 12 years into his term, brought in a new CEO.

‍

And there's a whole backstory to this, but yet they ended up doing some things that were not consistent with what they had been doing. And the house of cards collapsed. And it wasn't a house of cards, but the other foundation got eroded and it came down. They are now in the process of reinventing themselves again, and they're doing so quite well. This speaks to resiliency, it speaks to a consciousness of abundance in the sense that there are resources to start over with, and that developing that capacity to continuously start over, even in the face of what may seem to be catastrophic decline. Marriage dissolves, and partnership goes on the rocks. How do you start over? COVID hits. 

‍

Ross  

A job loss.

‍

Blaine  

A job loss. Yeah.

‍

Ross  

A job change can't go into the office.

‍

Blaine  

Trust myself. I mean, fundamentally for me, it comes back down to this question of leadership. Who's in charge? Well, my soul is in charge, and I am a vehicle what does it want to have expressed? And then I become the vehicle for that expression, the manifestation of what my imagining can tell me is possible. And one of the things about that bucket list that I was referencing a little bit ago, the key on that for me, is where does desire come in? Because I can have a list of all kinds of stuff in there, but some of them are gonna go, Whoa, there's a siren call to them. And all of a sudden, I now desire this, desire not from an average perspective. But this would be really cool. And this is where the, for the sake of what starts to come into play, that desire is the catalyst. And then I started looking for how do I make it happen.

‍

Ross  

But it's linked me to another question of these words of meaning, and I love your various articulations, and descriptions of thought, concepts and words. When you talk about desire, and a linked word in terms of motivation. And you're somebody who's described as one of the world's greatest motivators. And of course, we have intrinsic and extrinsic motivation, what you're talking about in desire is this internal motivation. And we can inspire that through what we go and discover, what we go and try to actually awaken desire, because desire in my view is something that is a fickle piece that needs inspiration, needs ambition, needs imagination, and when it hooks, it starts that chemical reaction, and it starts that piece, to then build part of our motivation.

‍

But I'm interested in terms of for us, we measure something called Motivation style, in the character, and we talk about this in a spectrum of playing, not to lose, this playing to protect, playing to defend. So what I've got, I need to look after it, and I'm motivated. So if I go through change, I go through adaption, that's my motivation, security and protection. Or on the other side, played a win by a burning ambition, not a burning platform. And so for us, it isn't about competency or it isn't, Am I motivated by mastery, or money or connection or relationship or fame? It's what's the style of motivation that will trigger change in you as a character? What's your experience of motivation, motivation styles and desire? I'm just fascinated of your thoughts. 

‍

Blaine  

Yeah, I love your questions, Ross. I mean, these are really thought provoking. Two types of motivation. One is extrinsic and one is intrinsic. In most management systems, extrinsic motivators are used a lot, we got reward systems out there. I mean, as a matter of fact, even our salaries and remuneration structures typically are extrinsic motivators. And we're going to go to work, get paid, and that's the motivation. None of that speaks to my dream. None of that speaks to who I am. None of that really speaks to what's important to me and what I value at my core. And the idea of desire, it's what if I've got a flax seed as an example, what does it want to become, well it wants to become a grain of flax. I need to find soil to plant that in.

‍

Then I need to nurture that soil and I need to make sure it's got the nutrients the flax it needs in order to actually begin to sprout. I don't have any control over when it sprouts. I mean, that's kind of, but I do have control over planning it and taking care of it and nurturing it and attending to it. And that's where internal motivation comes into play. It's what this kernel of desire, what wants to live, what wants to be expressed? And for me, and I've played a lot with this question for the sake of what. People set goals all the time. And usually when I start asking the question for the sake of what, oftentimes people go “Well, because my boss wants me to, or because it's the right thing to do, or because society says that this is the way to see to demonstrate I’m successful,” just kind of fill in the blanks. If asking the question for the sake of what begins to get answered from the perspective of, because that's who I am. That's where I want to start nurturing. That's what I want to start… 

‍

Ross  

You want to unlock?

‍

Blaine

That's what I want.

‍

Ross

It might need the five why's. 

‍

Blaine

Yeah, yeah, yeah. 

‍

Ross

Of those things. And there's of course, a bright side and a dark side to many things. Desire can have a bright side, it can motivate and it can serve. Desire can have a shadow side and a dark side and be the self justification to bad habits, to bad behaviors. And to me this links to mindset and abundance and scarcity. And very quickly the story Dan told me and a lot of his impact, he's had a lot of impact on me was talking about envy and jealousy. And about two farmers, one farmer, next door neighbor gets a cow. And the farmer looks and goes, “Wow, I like that cow.” Do I desire that cow? Am I jealous, am I envious? And he talks about the difference between my neighbor has a cow, there's enough cows, therefore, I would like a cow, I'll have a cow. So it's a positive motivator, to maybe, I'm not sure which way round of the jealousy or envy of it is, but I would then get one.

‍

The dark side of that would be, he has a cow, I don't have one. I don't want him to have one. I want him to lose his cow. So in terms of our desire, and we live in this society of team, complexity, different members, different from, stake stakeholders to, this expanded view of what that is from a shareholder to a stakeholder. What's this view of where desire, how can we navigate, potentially seeing away from the dark sides of it, and that adaption might be, “Ah, I don't want to do that, I don't want to follow the herd, I want to stay true to what I am and my true self.” Just speak a little bit about that, because my mind is spinning about desire and motivation.

‍

Blaine  

A good friend of mine, a fella named Joe Dispenza, has got a book out. He's got a number of books out. But one of the things that he says a lot, and I've actually worked with him around this concept is, you need to begin to think greater than your mind. Thinking greater than your mind. Now he has a very specific way of articulating this in a context in which he's articulating this, the mind isn't my brain. The mind is this holistic thing that I call my body. And it's made up of different very parts. There's a neurochemical process that begins to come into play here. And you mentioned chemicals at one point in time. How I describe something determines how I feel about it, how I feel about it generates my behavior.

‍

And we get into this loop, this repetitive loop, I think, this way, I feel this way I behave this way. I think this way, I feel this way. Now I start to feel this way, I start to think this way. And I feel I think, I think I feel I feel, I think I think I feel. Now all of a sudden, when I feel a certain way, there's chemicals that are released, and I get addicted to certain mood states, envy. I get addicted to certain behaviors because there's this endorphin rush or this dopamine release that occurs. I need to think greater than my mind is what Joe speaks about. And it has to do with being able to step back. Take a breath and Viktor Frankl talks about between stimulus and response. There is a space and that space I choose and in that choosing is freedom. So this is where awareness becomes very, very important. I notice I'm triggered. I notice that this habituated response, this habituated feeling is kicked in. I pause, just take a breath.

‍

Ross  

Slowing down to speed up.

‍

Blaine  

Slowing down. And then I make a choice, it may be the same choice I would have made. But it could be a different choice. And it'll be an uncomfortable choice because it's not habituated. And because it's not habituated, I'm going to have to practice it. If I want a different outcome. So if that's one way that begins to come into play. And this is why, for the sake of what am I wanting to do this or have this? Yeah, well, because he's got it and I don't well, okay, that's yeah, asset question.

‍

Ross  

Are you happy, or you don't feel happy, whatever these things are.

‍

Blaine  

Exactly.

‍

Ross  

It links as we wrap up back to some of the context of the world that we're living in, of societal shift and change, from big movements, like Black Lives Matter, and racial inequalities, economic inequalities, access to the vaccine, inequalities, all of these things that are thinking, stimulates behavior behind our own thinking this way, I behave this way, or I behave this way, therefore, I think this way, is a lot of our biases. And it comes back to this unlearning. And this breakthroughs that are needed that I'm going to pause, we're going to reassess, I'm going to give my permission to myself to make a new choice, not at the judgment of the choice I made yesterday.

‍

And to accept that is freeing, and that state of being at peace with myself. Because the choices I made I made consciously, I might make them different tomorrow. Therefore, it's not regret of yesterday, it's in informed, deliberate, new choices for right now. And I think that's an eternal pursuit for me for sure, is to take, to reflect, to listen and to consider. And we need space for those things when we are in this rock and roll. When we first connected for this call today, how was your weekend, Oh didn't do much and that was quite nice, a little bit about around the house around the garden.

‍

And this balance between the rock and the roll of our roller coaster lives is that we need rejuvenation, in order to Phoenix and spawn for tomorrow. And it's this balance in this cyclical cycle of our nature. I love that you talk a lot about nature, those things. I like to finish off with a, you mentioned your bucket list, whether there's anything on that bucket list that you would like to share with me as a dream you have, as a desire you have, an experience that you're looking for, maybe it's something for the first time, and that you would like to do and just share that with us as part of your own journey. And your adaption.

‍

Blaine  

One that is that it actually migrated to the top of my list, I want to do a Zero-G Flight. And it's about the experience, I want to, I scuba dived, I've experienced weightlessness in the ocean and in water. But there's something about and I've always, I've been just fascinated with space. I mean, just the exploration, the discovery, that the moving into that unknown. So Zero G is an approximation of that for me.

‍

Ross  

So have you connected to Peter, Peter Diamandis? 

‍

Blaine  

I know Peter. Yeah, yeah.

‍

Ross

Because he has obviously Zero-G. He took Stephen Hawking up. And so that you can definitely make happen. 

‍

Blaine  

Yeah. Oh, there's no question about that. That will be happening within the next, so that we can start getting out of our houses and stuff. Yeah, that's one thing that's coming up.

‍

Ross

Fantastic.

‍

Blaine  

Another one has to do with and then this is the kind of on the professional side. Yeah, and my, where I'm at in my life right now. Everything I do is about impact, that's really kind of where I'm organizing this book over my shoulder. For those of you that have got a video feed here is “Compassionate Capitalism: A Journey to the Soul of Business.” Part of my bucket list is putting in Steve Jobs where it's you're putting a dent in the universe around what it means to be a capitalist. 

‍

To my dying breath, I want to be doing things that are fostering compassion in the workplace in all of its varied forms. I have no idea how to go about doing that with a greatest impact. I just fumbled my way forward, but it's invigorating for me. And it's I mean, as a bucket list area it’s something I'm already engaged in but I'm looking for ways to really expand my footprint on that and expand how I go about doing that. And I'm having fun discovering because I'm doing stuff right now and COVID has been really a blessing in that regard. And I don't mean that facetiously. But it's allowed me to pause and explore different ways of…

‍

Ross

How to manifest that. 

‍

Blaine

Yeah, different ways of doing, as well as different ways of being, which has been very interesting. It's kind of like I kind of like what I'm finding out here.

‍

Ross  

I love that. And then this, shift and these careful, I encourage people to perhaps listen back to this episode, because there's so many gems Blaine that you've shared, that will change people's thinking, it will change their lives and unlock them to be a version of themselves that will bring a smile. And this phrase, at the end, where you were talking about the expansion of something, often I hear people talking about the pursuit, I want to pursue this, I want to go for this, that assumes you have none of it today. Expansion, you have something and you want to grow it, you want to grow your impact.

‍

These things, that language and stories we tell ourselves matter. And so choose that carefully of the narration of the storyline you tell yourself, because that informs our neural net and our mindset and our vision of what's possible. I want to thank you from the deep part of my heart and soul of the time that we spent, and I look forward to helping you co-elevate on your impact and expanding your impact as well. I'd love to do that with you, Blaine. So thank you very much. It's been really great.

‍

Blaine  

My absolute pleasure and the feeling is reciprocated. I love the whole idea of adaptability because it is ecumenical to change, obviously, but generative change. And that's what I want to see happening. So however I can support I'm in. Absolutely.

‍

Ross

Thanks again.

‍

Blaine  

Thanks, buddy.

‍

Voiceover  

Do you have the level of adaptability to survive and thrive in the rapid changes ahead? Has your resilience got more comeback than a yo-yo? Do you have the ability to unlearn in order to reskill, upskill, and breakthrough? Find out today and uncover your adaptability profile and score your AQ visit "AQai.io" To gain your personalized report across 15 scientifically validated dimensions of adaptability for limited time enter code "Podcast65" for a complimentary AQ me assessment. AQ AI transforming the way people, teams, and organizations navigate change.

‍

Outro

Thank you for listening to this episode of Decoding AQ. Please make sure you subscribe to your favorite podcast directory, and we'd love to hear your feedback. Please do leave a review and be sure to tune in next time for more insights from our amazing guests.

‍